2007-10-17 GnuCash IRC logs

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07:23:43 <checkbutton> hi
07:23:45 <checkbutton> anybody here?
07:25:31 <checkbutton> well. does anybody know where to get schemes for german accounting? I mean "Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung" and a germen "Bilanz"
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07:42:32 <checkbutton> hm
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10:14:17 <warlord> @tell checkbutton There are the SKR04 accounts available in the account hierarchy druid. File -> New -> New Account Hierarchy
10:14:17 <gncbot> warlord: The operation succeeded.
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11:57:10 <tj> hi :)
11:57:17 <jsled> hello
11:57:28 <warlord> hi
11:57:34 <tj> :)
11:57:41 <tj> it's nice here ^^
11:58:47 <tj> To get to the point, I'm looking for the gnucash tutorial. I installed gnucash, and the tutorial is missing. Any idea ? :/
11:59:13 <jsled> install the package 'gnucash-docs'
11:59:15 <tj> I installed the french version ('cause huh.. I'm french)
11:59:26 <tj> jsled: ho! ok, perfect
11:59:36 <tj> I try...
12:01:31 <tj> Haaaa :) it's working ^_^
12:01:46 <tj> thank you jsled :)
12:02:15 <jsled> you're welcome.
12:02:20 <jsled> What distro are you using?
12:03:00 <tj> what about the others package by the wat ? I mean gnucash-common, gnucash-sql and the others ? Should I install them as well ?
12:03:08 <tj> jsled: ubuntu
12:03:42 <jsled> gnucash-common should be installed as a dependency of gnucash. gnucash-sql is unnecessary.
12:03:51 <tj> ok.
12:04:42 <tj> in fact I did: sudo aptitude install gnucash, and that's all. So I don't need to install something else ? (except gnucash-docs)
12:05:10 <tj> ok, forget it ^^
12:05:15 <jsled> right.
12:05:43 <tj> there are no more package, except common and sql so..
12:05:45 <tj> ^^
12:06:02 <tj> Well thanks for all everyone :)
12:06:09 <tj> Bye
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13:23:01 <checkbutton> hi
13:23:01 <gncbot> checkbutton: Sent 3 hours and 8 minutes ago: <warlord> There are the SKR04 accounts available in the account hierarchy druid. File -> New -> New Account Hierarchy
13:25:04 <checkbutton> hello, and thanks for your answer. but I need two special reports
13:25:18 <checkbutton> don't know, in german they are called "Berichte"
13:26:21 <warlord> All reports that exist are in the distribution now.
13:26:34 <warlord> If the report you "need" isn't there, well, sorry, nobody has written it.
13:26:39 <warlord> You can ask on the gnucash-de mailing list.
13:27:02 <checkbutton> is there the possibility to import own reports?
13:27:22 <warlord> Of course. But you'd have to write them.
13:27:25 <warlord> (in scheme)
13:27:35 <warlord> anyways, I need to run -- offsite meeting starting.
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13:27:38 <checkbutton> yes i know
13:27:38 <checkbutton> :D
13:27:39 <jsled> yup; see http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports
13:27:45 <checkbutton> goodbye
13:27:47 <checkbutton> thanks
13:29:51 <andrewsw> hi. what do the little orange "X"'s mean in bugzilla?
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13:30:45 <jsled> andrewsw: where's that?
13:30:52 <checkbutton> Is there something like a wysiwyg editor for scheme?
13:31:09 <jsled> Oh, I think I know. It's a bandaid icon. For bugs that have patches attached to them.
13:31:26 <jsled> checkbutton: scheme isn't a visual language, so no.
13:31:39 <andrewsw> jsled: okay. makes sense. looky here if you like http://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?product=GnuCash&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=REOPENED&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&component=Reports
13:31:59 <jsled> yeah.
13:39:55 <checkbutton> well... this is bad... There are no reports that fit to the form german law demands
13:41:46 <andrewsw> checkbutton: is there an english version of the requirements?
13:43:11 <checkbutton> andrewsw: your mean the requirements of german law?
13:43:17 <andrewsw> yep.
13:43:27 <checkbutton> need to search. but could be
13:43:31 <checkbutton> I'll look
13:44:08 <andrewsw> I find it hard to believe that there isn't something existing, given the existence of a reasonably sized german user/dev base.
13:44:19 <jsled> I don't.
13:44:31 <andrewsw> :(
13:48:37 <checkbutton> german law is very fussy about financial reporting
13:49:31 <checkbutton> i'm just testing older versions of gnucash, perhaps there was some time ago the report i'm looking for
13:53:29 <jsled> there wasn't.
13:58:31 <checkbutton> just saw it
13:58:49 <checkbutton> but the manual says there is a Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung in Reports
13:58:54 <checkbutton> but there isn't
13:59:24 <checkbutton> I just need the "Einnahmeüberschussrechnung" in two columns
14:01:19 <jsled> Ah. "Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung" is Profit and Loss.
14:02:12 <jsled> The Profit and Loss report is now titled "Income Statement".
14:02:21 <checkbutton> in german?
14:05:21 <jsled> Google says "Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung". :)
14:06:24 <checkbutton> :D
14:07:02 <checkbutton> Well the one that comes near is "Einnahmeüberschussrechnung", but that is in one column and can't be changed
14:07:35 <jsled> Maybe "Ergebnis" or "Ergebnis (Erträge minus Aufwendungen)" or "Wertzuwachs und Verlust"?
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14:24:11 <checkbutton> no, nothing...
14:25:43 <andrewsw> if "Einnahmeberschussrechnung" == "Income Statement", in what way does it need to be two column?
14:25:57 <andrewsw> IOW, what data goes in which column?
14:27:12 <checkbutton> er well
14:27:23 <checkbutton> one moment
14:28:07 <checkbutton> ok
14:29:15 <checkbutton> in germany you close your expenses and income accounts in the "Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung" account
14:30:44 <checkbutton> and as you have in every account a debit and a credit side
14:30:57 <checkbutton> this reports needs to have two columns
14:31:51 <checkbutton> with expenses on the debit side
14:31:57 <checkbutton> and income on the credit side
14:33:07 <andrewsw> does this report show only the closing transactions (dr & cr) into the Gewin* account?
14:34:02 <andrewsw> oh crap
14:34:16 * andrewsw just started an 8 minute report run w/o thinking...
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14:42:42 <checkbutton> err I think you mean the right thing yes...
14:43:15 <checkbutton> it looks like the two column balance, but with the income and expenses accounts
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14:50:49 <andrewsw> two-column balance? maybe "Trial Balance"? under Income&Expense?
14:54:08 <checkbutton> no no already tried it
14:54:11 <andrewsw> does unselecting the asset and liability accounts in that report help at all?
14:54:32 <andrewsw> checkbutton: I don't know what you mean by "two column balance"
14:55:08 <checkbutton> asset and liability accounts are closed in the balance
14:55:36 <checkbutton> which has two columns, assets on the left, and liabilities on the right side
14:55:52 <checkbutton> i need the same for expenses and income
14:57:00 <andrewsw> what you describe above sounds like a basic "Balance Sheet" report which in my gnucash is *displayed* as one column
14:57:18 <andrewsw> but contains the two disctinct categories: assets and liabilities.
14:57:23 <checkbutton> the normal balance sheet can be displayed with two columns
14:57:27 <checkbutton> yes
14:57:29 <checkbutton> i know
14:57:48 <checkbutton> and i need the same but not for assets and liabilities but for expenses and income
14:57:50 <andrewsw> d'oh. excuse me
14:58:03 <andrewsw> I'm sorry. I never noticed that option in Balance sheet.
14:58:09 <checkbutton> ;)
14:58:35 <checkbutton> well, the balance sheet is ok as it is, but the income statement isn't
14:59:02 <checkbutton> if there would be the same feature to display it with two columns it would be perfect
14:59:04 <andrewsw> I understand. (phew, that was hard).
15:00:05 <checkbutton> :D
15:00:32 <checkbutton> it's very difficult to explain that in english when you only know the german terms
15:01:09 <andrewsw> yes! good job!
15:02:02 <checkbutton> b
15:02:04 <checkbutton> there
15:02:08 <checkbutton> erm
15:02:44 <checkbutton> the german documentation says, that there is a Gewinn- und Verlustrechnung report, but there isn't
15:03:02 <andrewsw> I see how this is done in the balance sheet and I *think* it can be done in the Income Statement.
15:03:05 <checkbutton> so i thought perhaps an older version would have it, but ... no :D
15:03:38 <checkbutton> this would be really really handy, because, as I said, german law is very fussy about this.
15:03:48 <andrewsw> I think that is just a renaming. And you *could* use a custom multi-column report, place two
15:03:59 <andrewsw> income statements in it with one set for income only and one for expense only.
15:04:10 <andrewsw> but that would not give you the totals.
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15:06:49 <andrewsw> yes, I think this fix would be pretty easy. Are you able to test a report?
15:07:52 <checkbutton> I hope
15:07:53 <checkbutton> :D
15:08:02 <checkbutton> just testing something
15:08:06 <checkbutton> one moment
15:11:41 <checkbutton> ok
15:12:06 <checkbutton> as you said, no totals
15:12:22 <andrewsw> but that gives an approximation of what you need?
15:12:33 <checkbutton> yes
15:13:06 <andrewsw> do you subscribe to gnucash-user@lists.gnucash.org?
15:13:47 <checkbutton> er no
15:13:51 <checkbutton> should i?
15:15:11 <andrewsw> up to you. I think I can make this report that you need, but can't do it today. How can I get you a report for testing?
15:15:26 <checkbutton> email?
15:15:37 <checkbutton> so_n@gmx.net
15:16:17 <andrewsw> okay. Give me a few days and I'll send you one to test.
15:16:36 <andrewsw> if I have questions about how it should be implemented I'll mail you as well.
15:16:58 <checkbutton> thank you very very much.
15:17:19 <checkbutton> it isn't urgent
15:17:33 <andrewsw> thank me when it works. I'm pretty new to report writing, so I'm only guessing I can do it.
15:17:39 <andrewsw> okay.
15:17:48 <andrewsw> I have to do real work now. cheers.
15:18:09 <checkbutton> :D
15:18:37 <checkbutton> thank you anyways, even if you don't get it work. :)
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15:53:54 <Mason> Hey guys, is there a way to export a set of accounts in a csv file. I am sure I read you could do it, but cant seem to find where I read it
15:55:13 <jsled> You can't, exactly.
15:55:28 <jsled> http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_How_can_I_export_data.3F
15:56:14 <Mason> thanks, il have a look at that
16:01:01 <Mason> thanks for the link, some useful stuff on that wiki, gonna spend a while on there now I think
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16:12:52 <Mason> last question, I think. To backup all my transactions, am I correct to think that all I need to do is to backup the gzipped file with the same name as the set of accounts?
16:14:15 <jsled> Yeah ... there's your datafile. Its name is in the window titlebar.
16:14:33 <jsled> There some .xac and .log files, but see <http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_are_all_these_.xac_and_.log_files_filling_up_my_directory.3F>.
16:14:46 <Mason> yeah, thats what I just read, figured I would just get confirmation
16:14:46 <Mason> thanks
16:14:49 <jsled> Also, there's some stuff in ~/.gnucash/ ... in particular, settings and saved reports.
16:15:02 <jsled> But if you don't care about those, just your datafile is fine.
16:15:21 <Mason> datafile contains the account structure as well as the transactions?
16:15:29 <Mason> I spose they have to be one and the same
16:15:33 <jsled> yup.
16:15:37 <Mason> thanks
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16:47:19 <RobbieAB> Does goffice versions matter with gnucash?
17:10:17 <jsled> RobbieAB: uh, yeah. 0.0.4 <= 0.4 should all work.
17:10:47 <jsled> er 0.0.4 <= $ver <= 0.4
17:13:33 <RobbieAB> jsled: but >=0.5 will break?
17:14:24 <jsled> configure doesn't look for it; the presumption is that it will (since they rev'ed the library version number). But if, and if so: to what extent, I don't yet know.
17:14:50 <RobbieAB> This will make ebuild writing interesting... :S
17:15:16 <jsled> why?
17:15:42 <jsled> Well, might mean goffice needs to slot.
17:15:43 <RobbieAB> Well, tthe ebuilds don't allow specification of a range like that...
17:16:05 <RobbieAB> goffice will be slotting anyway, abiword and gnumeric will probably force it soon.
17:16:22 <jsled> In this case, saying <= 0.4 would be fine, since 0.0.4 was the first release of the library, I think.
17:16:45 <RobbieAB> Ah, I hadn't realised that. Thank you.
17:16:47 <jsled> (of course, it be nice if we had gentoo had goffice-0.4, but ...)
17:17:06 <RobbieAB> It's coming, but first we need to ensure that it doesn't break anything.
17:17:12 <jsled> ah.
17:17:24 <jsled> Oh ... cause you're with gentooexperimental.org ...
17:17:35 <jsled> And you're working to get gnome-2.20 in?
17:17:48 <RobbieAB> Actaully, that is mre because I hang with the wrong crowd on freenode...
17:18:08 <RobbieAB> I think they are, I'm not actually a dev, I just have an active interest in goffice.
17:18:18 <jsled> ah. heh. :)
17:18:21 <RobbieAB> And hence abiword, gnumeric, and gnucash.
17:18:30 <jsled> Right.
17:18:56 <jsled> Well, if 0.5 was masked in an overlay, it might make it incrementally easier for me to get gnucash working with it.
17:19:06 <jsled> (Assuming I could find the time.)
17:19:43 <jsled> Or, if you maybe know off-hand: could I just copy the goffice-0.2 ebuild into a local overlay and rename/number it to get goffice-0.5 to install, or is it trickier?
17:20:00 <jsled> I'd *guess* that the differences in 0.5 are going to be maybe cairo and gtk-print support.
17:20:30 <jsled> Which should only require relatively small changes to gnucash ...
17:20:44 <RobbieAB> I have a 0.4.2 goffice ebuild that works.
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17:21:04 <RobbieAB> It should be a trivial change to make it 0.5
17:21:21 <jsled> is it in a layman-accessible overlay?
17:22:39 <RobbieAB> I'll see if I can make it work for 0.5 and shove it up on d.ge.o when it does.
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17:28:28 <RobbieAB> Stupid question, but does gnucash-2.0.5 actually need goffice?
17:28:34 <jsled> yes.
17:28:44 <jsled> why do you ask?
17:29:06 <jsled> Oh. I bet I know why you're asking.
17:29:20 <jsled> Yeah. 2.0 includes hacked versions of goffice (and libgsf) for systems that don't have them.
17:29:39 <jsled> So, strictly, no, it doesn't.
17:29:47 <jsled> But it's always preferrable to use system/installed versions.
17:29:54 <RobbieAB> And also, which version number is needed if it is to use an external version?
17:30:12 <RobbieAB> 0.2? Or an earlier version?
17:30:23 <jsled> I believe all of 0.0.4, 0.2.x and 0.4.x work.
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17:30:38 <RobbieAB> Ah, ok.
17:30:53 <jsled> That is, I believe there are systems using all those versions.
17:31:31 <jsled> Though that copy in the source tree was of 0.0.4 ... and I'm not sure anyone's built gnucash-2.2 against 0.0.4.
17:31:39 <jsled> But, at the same time, I'
17:31:57 <RobbieAB> Well, I just looked at the configure.ac, and unlike the 2.2 configures it doesn't check for goffice versions.
17:32:10 <RobbieAB> Which is why I was wondering.
17:32:23 <jsled> I'm not sure if there were any changes in the relevant bits of our sources between 2.0 and 2.2.
17:33:00 <RobbieAB> Ah, ok.
17:33:13 <RobbieAB> Will note that there may be issues for the moment.
17:33:46 <jsled> That's ... not right. configure.in checks for 0.4, 0.2 and 0.0.4 in order.
17:34:37 <jsled> (Or, actually, libgoffice-0.4, -0.3 and -1
17:34:38 <jsled> )
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17:36:30 <jsled> Sorry. I've gotta run. Take care.
17:37:39 <RobbieAB> you too.
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18:03:20 <RobbieAB> jsled: http://dev.gentooexperimental.org/~robbieab/ebuilds/ there is a slotted, "works for me" goffice-0.5.0 ebuild in there.
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19:09:37 <warlord> .
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19:24:32 <andrewsw> hi. what is the best way to submit patches for option changes in reports? -devel or enhancement at bugzilla w/ patch?
19:27:15 <warlord> Either way. Both?
19:28:31 <andrewsw> both? I already make so much noise... okay.
19:29:33 <warlord> Might as well. ;)
19:30:47 <andrewsw> heh. 'cause I already make so much, I might as well make more? :)
19:30:52 * andrewsw laughs
19:34:42 <warlord> :)
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