2008-12-17 GnuCash IRC logs

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07:40:15 <treeman> can anyone tell me how to use the employee functions?
07:42:51 <treeman> we do payroll the way gnucash shows in the tutorial, but i can't figure out how to also use the employee functions and tie them in with the payroll
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08:48:02 *** warlord-afk is now known as warlord
08:48:20 <warlord> treeman: GnuCash doesn't have payroll, and the Empllyee functions are only for Expense Vouchers
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08:56:48 <treeman> so what would you use an expense voucher for? i'm guessing that it's not to tie in with my "payroll"?
08:57:20 <warlord> Correct. It's for Reimbursed Employee Expenses
08:57:37 <treeman> oooo
08:57:52 <treeman> ok then
08:58:37 <treeman> so what would i do if i wanted to list a record of my employee's payments? just do a search for any transaction that has his name in it?
08:59:00 <warlord> No, you cannot just add transactions to that.
09:00:40 <treeman> on a different topic...
09:01:08 <treeman> i know how to find a certain customer, but what if i want to view every customer i've ever had? is that possible?
09:01:47 <warlord> Yes.. Do you want to see every customer you've ever created, or only those that you invoiced?
09:02:01 <treeman> only the ones that i've invoiced
09:02:41 <warlord> In the former case, Business -> Find Customer -> [Name] [Matches Regex] . (or just leave it empty)
09:03:06 <warlord> For the latter case, run the Receivable Aging report, then set the report option to display 0 amounts
09:03:53 <treeman> very nice
09:03:55 <treeman> thanks
09:04:00 <treeman> i do have another question though
09:04:14 <treeman> i have a problem printing anything from gnucash
09:04:29 <treeman> ie. income statements, bar charts, etc.
09:05:04 <treeman> it's always off the page, ie. gnucash makes it so wide it won't all fit on the page, and i can't figure out how to shrink it down
09:05:42 <treeman> when i want to print an income statement for example, i have to export as an html and print it from a browser
09:12:32 <warlord> I've noticed that with some reports, and I dont know why.
09:12:46 <warlord> It's been like that since GtkHTML-1.1
09:13:07 <treeman> ahhh
09:13:27 <jsled> treeman: our html engine is shit. It's gtkhtml, which is basically used by evolution to format html email.
09:13:49 <jsled> the 'export and print in a real browser' is the regular suggested workaround.
09:15:36 <treeman> oh ok
09:16:33 <treeman> what's the latest version of gnucash btw?
09:19:04 <jsled> 2.2.8
09:19:10 <jsled> released … just a few days ago.
09:20:24 <treeman> i have 2.2.1, would it be worth me upgrading?
09:20:31 <jsled> yes
09:20:35 <jsled> what distro/os?
09:21:23 <treeman> ubuntu
09:21:57 <jsled> hmm. You're on 7.10, then?
09:22:15 <jsled> treeman: you should see <http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Ubuntu>, regardless.
09:22:37 <warlord> Oooh! Yes, 2.2.1 is VERY broken.
09:22:44 <jsled> There's this PPA repository business that I still don't fully understand, but promises a better gnucash package for ubuntu.
09:24:08 <treeman> ok
09:24:30 <treeman> i'm not sure what version of ubuntu to be honest
09:24:55 <treeman> i'm not as familiar with computers as i am trees :)
09:25:15 <jsled> heh
09:25:53 <treeman> we have had a couple problems with this version though
09:29:27 <treeman> it is 7.10 , BTW
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10:39:19 <Patrick_> Hi, it seems that for 2.2.8, gconfd.exe has been compiled as 16bit which makes it impossible to run Gnucash on x64. It used to work with 2.2.7
10:39:43 <Patrick_> Could that be?
10:46:14 <warlord> I doubt it's 16-bit ... that would be HIGHLY unlikley.
10:47:13 <Patrick_> warlord: but vista x64 complains
10:48:24 <warlord> I would blame vista.
10:48:37 <warlord> But honestly I have no idea.. Send mail to andi?
10:49:12 <Patrick_> whats the address?
10:51:08 <Patrick_> warlord: whats the address?
10:54:32 <warlord> Try the gnucash-user mailing list.
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11:52:12 <mulicheng> Are new packages for the binary unstable downloads no longer being published? The latest on sourceforge is 2.1.5.
11:53:16 <jsled> sounds right.
11:54:03 <mulicheng> So if you want a "Truly" unstable or current development package.. then building from source is the way to go it sounds like?
11:57:08 <jsled> yup, building from svn is the way to go.
11:58:32 <mulicheng> Sounds good. I'm on a mac though and used fink to install GnuCash. I'm pretty comfortable with building and tweaking on software, but haven't really wanted to invest the time to get into fink's package system really.
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12:28:04 <warlord> I'm not sure why you would want a 2.1 series when 2.2.8 was just released.
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12:39:39 <mulicheng> I wouldn't.
12:40:06 <mulicheng> I was curious why the oldest unstable packages were still on 2.1.x is all.
12:44:04 <andrewsw> hey all
12:44:37 <andrewsw> I want to get the length of a translated string in scheme.
12:45:05 <andrewsw> I need to get the actual length of the string in it's translated form so that I can set the width of some html cells appropriately.
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12:45:13 <andrewsw> How best to go about this?
12:49:17 <andrewsw> IOW, if there is a string defined: (define string (_ "foo"))
12:49:41 <andrewsw> if I later access string, do I get "foo" or do I get the translated "fooen"?
12:54:36 <andrewsw> nm, I think I can just concat one table into another and that will fix my cell sizing...
12:57:30 <warlord> mulicheng: because we haven't started the 2.3 series yet.
12:58:00 <warlord> andrewsw: translated
12:58:26 <andrewsw> thx warlord
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13:30:14 <andrewsw> hmmm... concat'ing html tables is not pretty...
13:33:01 <warlord> No, it's not.
13:33:03 <warlord> ;)
13:33:16 <andrewsw> oh? what am I missing?
13:33:59 <andrewsw> I get a bunch of (#unknown)'s
13:34:08 <andrewsw> with my naive solution
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13:36:45 <warlord> How/why are you trying to concat tables?
13:38:19 <andrewsw> I'm looking for a simple solution to the income statement's mis-aligned columns problem.
13:38:54 <andrewsw> The "net income for period" line is attached to the expense table, forcing it's first column wider
13:39:03 <andrewsw> thus the thing looks ugly.
13:39:30 <andrewsw> I thought maybe I could just grab rows off one table, append them to the other and then get the columns all pretty by default.
13:39:48 <andrewsw> But no, it requires something more sophisticated than that.
13:39:52 <andrewsw> (and more time than I have today)
13:41:24 <andrewsw> I think I need to either build the tables all-together into one as the rows are generated, or I have to pad the fields with &nbsp;
13:46:26 <mulicheng> Perhaps a style sheet for the report might fix the problem.
13:46:32 <mulicheng> or a style sheet update.
13:46:46 <mulicheng> I haven't played with those at all though.. just a thought.
13:47:01 <andrewsw> I'm not sure.
13:47:19 <andrewsw> As the report is currently written, two html tables are created, one for income and one for expense.
13:47:49 <andrewsw> those two tables are then placed in the page appropriately for the chosen layout.
13:48:21 <andrewsw> the problem is to determine the size of the first column of two tables and apply the larger size to the smaller-size table.
13:48:42 <andrewsw> it's a hack, but I think padding is the way to do it, frankly.
13:49:18 <warlord> No, style sheets wont help... it's not CSS
13:50:10 <warlord> andrewsw: I'm afraid I still dont understan dthe problem.
13:50:40 <andrewsw> it's a minor cosmetic problem. run an income statement with a depth of two and look at how the columns line-up.
13:51:05 <andrewsw> or maybe just a depth of 1.
13:51:39 <andrewsw> the income section values will line up nicely with themselves. likewise the expense section values.
13:52:17 <andrewsw> but the two sections do not line up their values. It is because of the wider column requirement of the "Net Income for period" cell on the last line.
13:56:26 <andrewsw> I suppose another hackish solution is to make the "Net ... for period" it's own entry in the page instead of tacking it onto the expense table.
13:56:48 <andrewsw> but then it would no longer be right-justified with the number immediately above it.
13:58:12 <warlord> Why not make it a combined cell?
13:58:27 <andrewsw> make what a combined cell?
13:59:49 <warlord> The "Net... for period".
14:00:00 <warlord> Instead of putting it into a single cell, combine all the cells together.
14:00:44 <andrewsw> oh. instead of |Net Income... | | | $1234|
14:00:52 <andrewsw> |Net INcome... $1234|?
14:01:44 <andrewsw> that would help, I suppose, but you'd still have the potential problem of the income and expense sections having different sized first columns
14:02:09 <andrewsw> escpecially if there is a great disparity in the size of the translated words "Total Income/Expense"
14:02:54 <warlord> this is true -- so if you want that then you'll need one table.
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14:03:24 <andrewsw> yep. it's really a bike shed issue, imo, but it's become much more complicated to address than I originally thought.
14:04:03 <warlord> dont make individual tables, just keep adding rows.
14:04:10 <warlord> ... to one table
14:04:49 <andrewsw> yep. that requires moving the layout logic into the data generation logic.
14:05:01 <andrewsw> (amazing how complicated just the reporting system is...)
14:06:00 <warlord> no it shouldnt.. unless your data generation logic is assuming something about the layout.
14:06:19 <andrewsw> this arose from some crazy germans wanting to see expenses listed before income and then the option of using two columns instead of one...
14:06:35 <warlord> crazy germans!
14:06:41 <andrewsw> he he!
14:07:07 <andrewsw> the simple solution was to generate two tables, one each for income and expense and then do layout any ol' way...
14:08:11 <warlord> instead of generating tables generate a list of "row data", and then form that into the display later.
14:08:12 <andrewsw> now some nutty norwegian wants the columns all perfectly aligned... ;-P
14:08:19 <andrewsw> yep. nice
14:08:31 <andrewsw> thx
14:08:48 <andrewsw> btw, I've been doing some haskell lately, pretty fun, but it's quite a switch back to scheme...
14:08:55 <warlord> heh
14:09:02 <andrewsw> can we switch our reporting language to haskell?
14:09:05 * andrewsw ducks and runs
14:10:00 <warlord> LOL
14:12:53 <jsled> wow, if you wanted one of the few options that's *less* gnucash-end-user friendly! :)
14:13:11 <jsled> hell, LOLCODE would probably be more approachable.
14:13:25 <benjamin> pah!
14:13:29 <benjamin> real men use brainfuck
14:13:45 <andrewsw> can haz piggy-bank?
14:15:00 <andrewsw> I think gnucash has a responsibility to maintaining a reporting language that annoys 99% of users. changing to arbitrarily selected non-mainstream languages for no reason is a valid implementation of that
14:15:10 <andrewsw> :)
14:15:11 <benjamin> agree
14:17:55 <warlord> heg
14:17:57 <warlord> heh
14:18:52 <benjamin> hei
14:18:56 <benjamin> hej
14:18:59 <andrewsw> hek
14:19:05 <benjamin> hel
14:19:15 <andrewsw> a
14:19:17 <andrewsw> hem
14:19:28 <benjamin> anyway
14:19:48 <benjamin> to save further childishness, I shall report on a small victory
14:19:57 <andrewsw> do tell...
14:20:01 <benjamin> I have counteracted the annoying timeout popup forced on me by my bank
14:20:10 <benjamin> turns out it was just a javascript
14:20:26 <andrewsw> heh, bank security.
14:20:54 <benjamin> precisement
14:21:13 <andrewsw> so fixing this stupid alignment problem is *way*more work than I have time for... maybe I'll get a break over the holiday and be able to tackle it.
14:21:15 <benjamin> and they charge me 65p to pay in a cheque
14:21:28 <benjamin> goodo
14:21:41 <andrewsw> do they charge for online payment as well?
14:21:56 <benjamin> no, I'm on the online tariff
14:22:07 <andrewsw> I'm thinking of just signing all my paychecks over to the bank and then just begging for food from them.
14:22:08 <benjamin> but I don't get any credit interest.
14:22:30 <andrewsw> It would be easier than this silly game where they pretend to give me my money and then take it all back in fees
14:22:46 <benjamin> quite.
14:22:58 <benjamin> they overcharged me for fees one month
14:23:16 <benjamin> I went in and complained very loudly and they repaid me 150% of the overcharge...
14:23:23 <benjamin> but I'm sure that was also a mistake
14:23:47 <andrewsw> they charge me for the privilege of keeping my money. They charge me when I ask for my money back. it's pretty disgusting.
14:24:07 <andrewsw> and my bank is pretty decent...
14:24:07 <benjamin> do you not get credit interest?
14:24:39 <andrewsw> on some balances I do. but it's pretty pitiful, typically under 1%
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14:25:00 <benjamin> :S
14:25:41 <benjamin> {$country}{ian|ish|ch|} banking system ftw, I suppose
14:26:17 * andrewsw hates that C-x C-s is "cut cell contents and save" in oocalc
14:26:52 <benjamin> what would you prefer it to be? :S
14:27:13 <jsled> save-buffer. :)
14:27:18 <andrewsw> ding ding
14:27:27 <benjamin> *tut*
14:27:37 <jsled> just use spreadsheet mode in emacs. :)
14:27:45 <benjamin> precisely
14:27:49 <andrewsw> yeah, I need to learn that I suppose
14:28:01 <benjamin> emacs is a pretty good OS, but I prefer firefox...
14:28:03 <andrewsw> or maybe I shouldn't mix coding and book-keeping
14:28:15 <benjamin> *ding*
14:29:03 <andrewsw> just need to get emacs to run on bare metal
14:30:00 <jsled> Oh, that'd be a good april first press release … the first commercially available emacs-lisp processor and -machine.
14:30:22 <jsled> Hmm. Or maybe a software package that uses your video card's GPU for elisp evaluation?
14:30:43 <jsled> emacs-accelerator!™
14:31:34 <warlord> emacs-accelerator? but i just met ...
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14:42:21 <Olipro> I just installed 2.2.8 and when I try to start it
14:42:41 <Olipro> gconfd-2 keeps flashing up but dies with a "not enough memory"
14:42:45 <Olipro> the program eventually starts
14:43:00 <Olipro> but doesn't actually work
14:43:11 <benjamin> erm...
14:43:12 <jsled> huh. this is the second report of this we've heard in here.
14:43:27 <benjamin> do you have enough memory?
14:43:33 <Olipro> I've got 2GB RAM mate
14:43:38 <Olipro> this isn't a piece of shite
14:43:53 <jsled> Olipro: please add your details to <http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=564797>
14:43:57 <Olipro> the paging file should be large enough to cope anyway
14:44:05 <benjamin> 0.0
14:44:28 <Olipro> ah-ha, that corba stuff is the same error I get when the GUI (eventually) appears
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14:57:02 <Olipro> I think I'll try dumping parts of 2.2.7 into 2.2.8
15:01:01 <Olipro> heh that was simple
15:01:11 <Olipro> I replaced gconfd-2.exe in libexec with the one from 2.2.7
15:01:14 <Olipro> instantly fixed
15:01:42 <andrewsw> can you add that to the bug report as a temporary work-around?
15:02:51 <Olipro> already done
15:02:55 <warlord> Thanks!
15:03:23 <andrewsw> there's another report on -user where something similar happens in vista
15:04:15 <Olipro> hm, seems like it might not actually be that simple
15:04:24 <Olipro> it was using libs from the 227 install
15:04:46 <Olipro> I'm installing 228 now in a separate folder to make it use the new libs, then I'll replace gconfd2
15:04:48 <andrewsw> is this in andi5's newly rebuilt w/ italian translation version? maybe someone could just stick up the previous one to minimize the bleeding
15:04:50 <Olipro> that'll confirm it
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15:08:45 <Olipro> OK, confirmed
15:08:54 <Olipro> replacing gconfd-2.exe in libexec will fix it
15:12:18 <benjamin> hmm, I wonder if I can use "vorsprung durch bibliotechnik" as my publishing company's tagline...
15:13:16 <andrewsw> I take that back, the windows binary on sourceforge is from 12/14/08, so maybe the italian help version isn't up yet?
15:15:42 <Olipro> crap, same problem with qt3-wizard in aqbanking
15:48:06 <warlord> Where is andi5 when we need him?
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17:18:14 <mulicheng> Is it common to have subaccounts of a checking account?
17:18:40 <mulicheng> Suppose I add $100 deposit to checking.. but then transfer $50 each to two subaccounts. How do you then reconsile w/ the bank statement?
17:19:20 <benjamin> I think you reconcile with the figure provided by the checking account itself
17:19:28 <benjamin> or just add up all the subaccounts
17:19:51 <mulicheng> I see that you do see the total of the subaccounts on the parent account in the main window.
17:19:57 <warlord> mulicheng: click "include subaccounts" in the reconcile dialog.
17:20:01 <mulicheng> but opening the transaction register shows a 0 balance in my example.
17:20:43 <mulicheng> I'll test it out thx.
17:22:10 <mulicheng> Wondering if the subaccount is a good idea for some of my side work.
17:22:27 <mulicheng> I do consulting work here and there, but I don't have a separate bank account for that money.
17:22:33 <benjamin> I use it for budgets
17:22:55 <benjamin> within my savings account is a subaccount named "shoes", for instance
17:23:10 <benjamin> and there's a standing order with my, ah, checking account to deposit money into it
17:23:33 <mulicheng> makes sense.
17:23:39 <benjamin> indeed
17:24:00 <mulicheng> I'm considering doing budgets that way too actually.
17:24:14 <benjamin> you, however, should probably just have an income subaccount rather than a checking subaccount
17:24:24 <mulicheng> I haven't used GnuCash long enough to see the include subaccounts option on the reconsile page though.
17:24:41 <mulicheng> I do already have an income subaccount for the side work.
17:24:45 <benjamin> ah
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17:51:22 <mulicheng> benjamin: do you spend money out of your checking or savings?
17:51:42 <mulicheng> e.g., suppose you buy some shoes... but it's with your checking account.
17:52:04 <mulicheng> how do you get the money from the subaccount in savings back to the checking account and to the appropriate expense?
17:52:49 <benjamin> it's a complicated dance of transactions
17:53:10 <mulicheng> I actually wrote a blog post about budgeting, but I'm really not entirely convinced I did it the write way.
17:53:36 <mulicheng> my budget accounts are liabilites and I have an asset that is my budgeted cash.
17:53:39 <mulicheng> so they balance.
17:53:45 <mulicheng> but I have to record things twice.
17:54:13 <mulicheng> one is the money => expense and the other is the budgeted cash => budget
17:54:28 <benjamin> fair enough ^_^
17:54:55 <mulicheng> perhaps there is a better way. That is part of the reason I'm interested in the sub accounts thing too.
17:54:58 <benjamin> my system is to credit the savings subaccount and debit the current account, then credit the current and debit the expense
17:55:38 <mulicheng> Is your savings account a "real" account?
17:55:48 <mulicheng> it sounds like our systems are actually pretty similar.
17:56:22 <benjamin> yes, it's a real account
17:56:49 <mulicheng> what about the current account then?
17:56:57 <benjamin> the current account is also real
17:57:02 <mulicheng> you really transfer money between accounts for every transaction?
17:57:07 <benjamin> well, no
17:57:13 <benjamin> I transfer a big lump
17:57:45 <benjamin> I transfer money from savings into my current account at the start of the day, use my debit card during the shopping trip, and then do the books upon my return
17:58:08 <mulicheng> I see.
17:58:44 <benjamin> quite
17:59:06 <benjamin> it'd be more convenient to have the bank automatically transfer money from the savings into the current account when the latter reaches a nil balance
17:59:32 <mulicheng> I have that set up w/ my checking/home equity.
17:59:53 <mulicheng> but I usually spend most of my money from a credit card, and then pay off the balance once a month.
17:59:53 <benjamin> ah.
17:59:56 <benjamin> I don't own a home
18:00:19 <benjamin> ah, yes, that's a good way to do it also... but I am told that tends to lead to temptation to overspend
18:00:34 <mulicheng> That's why we have a budget :)
18:00:53 <mulicheng> It's really a good system for the self-controlled.
18:00:57 <benjamin> yes
18:01:01 <benjamin> I'm not self-controlled ^_^
18:01:09 <benjamin> I need gnucash to, ah, control me ¬.¬
18:01:35 <mulicheng> because you put all your savings into the equity account.. and the lower balance causing you to pay less interest on what you would otherwise owe the bank.
18:01:49 <benjamin> oh, I see...
18:02:23 <mulicheng> upon paying the loan off, take another one out.. lower your home mortgage by the difference, and do the same thing again.
18:02:42 <mulicheng> nice buffer for hard economic times too.
18:02:53 <mulicheng> as long as the bank doesn't close your equity account I guess.
18:02:59 <mulicheng> they won't though.. it's a source of income for them.
18:03:06 <benjamin> hmm
18:03:30 <benjamin> interesting
18:03:55 <benjamin> depends if your mortgage interest exceeds your savings interest, I suppose
18:04:05 <mulicheng> at this point it does.
18:04:17 <benjamin> right
18:04:24 <mulicheng> HE accounts are usually either fixed at a higher rate or tied to prime+something.
18:04:34 <mulicheng> but right now, prime+something is like 2.9 for me.
18:04:56 <mulicheng> I can fix a balance at a rate on my line too.
18:05:07 <mulicheng> so if it ever gets up to my home interest rate, I always fix the rate.
18:05:30 <mulicheng> had it fixed at approx 6 and they went up to 8.5 or 9.. then the economy woes.
18:05:42 <mulicheng> when they went back below, I unfixed the rate.
18:05:59 <benjamin> ah, sounds pleasant
18:06:23 <mulicheng> it is now.
18:06:40 <mulicheng> rate is so low I'm tempted just to pay all the extra into my mortgage and keep a balance on the HE line.
18:07:38 <mulicheng> anyway, I haven't quite figured out how to do my budgets with subaccounts instead of separate budget accounts though.
18:08:40 <benjamin> hm
18:10:35 <mulicheng> Part of the problem is that we spend out of several accounts.
18:11:07 <mulicheng> so I can't really have a budget for "shoes" for instance as a subaccount of my checking account, because I may pay for the shoes with my credit card or something.
18:11:24 <benjamin> ah
18:11:35 <benjamin> er
18:11:46 <benjamin> you'll be paying the card balance with the checking account, though
18:12:48 <mulicheng> yes but I want to see my budget balance when I make the purchase, not have to wait until I pay the card.
18:13:01 <mulicheng> plus, I don't want to have to do a huge split transaction when I pay the card.
18:13:59 <benjamin> ah
18:14:11 <mulicheng> Also, like I said, I don't really store that much money in the checking account, it's in the HE line.
18:14:24 <benjamin> quite
18:16:33 <mulicheng> You can read how I set things up if you like: http://allmybrain.com/2008/12/15/better-budgeting-with-gnucash/
18:16:47 <mulicheng> If you have a way to do it without entering things twice, I'd be very interested :)
18:16:48 <benjamin> ok, so long as the american references don't annoy me
18:17:14 <benjamin> I'm not sure why they do, it's quite irritating
18:17:50 <warlord> Such as?
18:19:01 <benjamin> the spellings
18:19:27 <benjamin> the use of the word "equity" in place of capital, for no reason I've ever been told
18:19:58 <benjamin> the word "grocery"
18:20:07 <mulicheng> Does gnucash outside america translations substitute capital for equity?
18:20:19 <benjamin> nope.
18:20:29 <benjamin> it confused me extensively
18:20:58 <warlord> Grocery? What's wrong with Grocery?
18:21:14 <warlord> I just went to the grocery store the other day to buy groceries.
18:22:02 <warlord> As for equity... I dont know why it's used in place of capital, except that the phrase "equity owner" is used by the IRS.. And it's not how much capital you have in your house, it's how much equity you have in your house.. and so forth.
18:22:30 <benjamin> we call groceries "food" ¬.¬
18:23:17 <benjamin> and yes, but you still use phrases like "market capitalization" which refers to the amount of capital/equity invested in a company
18:23:18 <warlord> Ah, but is it food you by in a restaurant? or food you buy to cook at home? and what about your hand soap, paper towels, etc?
18:23:45 <warlord> True, but market capitalization isn't used in accounting.
18:24:38 <benjamin> I think that last lot are just called toiletries
18:24:59 <benjamin> and not all supermarkets here stock them... you might go to a pharmacy
18:25:47 <benjamin> and no, but if you're running a business, you're financed by capital, surely
18:26:24 <warlord> It's still called "Owner's Equity" in the company.
18:26:43 <benjamin> interesting
18:26:45 <warlord> However there is "Capital Withdrawal" when an owner takes money out of the bus.
18:27:16 <benjamin> well then :P
18:27:20 <benjamin> you can't escape it
18:27:57 <benjamin> nonetheless
18:28:01 <benjamin> mulicheng: that's a good article
18:28:24 <mulicheng> Thanks
18:28:45 <mulicheng> Doing my part to promote good software :)
18:28:48 <warlord> mulicheng: how about copying it over to the gnucash wiki?
18:28:50 <benjamin> if you wanted to do budgeting without subaccounts, perhaps you could maintain a spreadsheet with the budgets and calculate your disposable income that way?
18:29:08 <warlord> Anyways, I gotta run. good evening all
18:29:09 *** warlord is now known as warlord-afk
18:29:34 <mulicheng> Do I need to create an account to edit the wiki?
18:30:03 <mulicheng> I'd really like gnucash to contain budget+financial data both.
18:30:29 <jsled> yes re: account for wiki (spam problems. :(
18:30:32 <jsled> )
18:31:20 <mulicheng> I don't mind if someone copies the article who has write access already.
18:32:45 <mulicheng> Or I'll create an account and someone could give me write access if that is preferred.
18:33:04 <mulicheng> I still think there may be a better way then I came up with though.
18:33:05 <jsled> just creating the account gets you write access (to everything except /wiki/GnuCash itself)
18:33:23 <mulicheng> Oh, I see.
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18:34:40 <benjamin> pardon me, lads, has anyone seen my brolly in the lift? I misplaced it on my way up from the car park
18:36:47 <benjamin> it's a little grey bugger, with HM Royal Mail's insignia on the top
18:36:58 <benjamin> cost me fifty quid
18:37:26 <benjamin> .... that's the equivalent of what Americans sound like, to my hyperactive reticular activating system
18:40:29 <benjamin> hm?
18:40:40 <benjamin> is that american for "bye"? :)
18:42:43 <benjamin> oh, ok
18:47:07 <benjamin> it will, of course, now look like I'm talking to myself
18:49:36 <mulicheng> what will?
18:49:47 <mulicheng> oh I get it.. in the logs.
18:49:57 <benjamin> yeah
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22:41:04 <dennis> Ready to debug aqbanking now.
22:41:23 <dennis> Added some aqbanking debug environment variables to the console.
22:41:47 <dennis> screen closes with no error msg when I attempt to get accounts.
22:42:05 <dennis> debug messages say invalid user or password.
22:42:13 <dennis> perhaps the fid is not correct for my bank.
22:42:32 <dennis> is there a way to find what Quicken is using as the server connect URL and FID?
22:42:55 <dennis> Because this account works in Quicken.
22:42:58 <warlord> dennis: There is a way to tell Quicken to save the ofx log... But I have no idea how.
22:43:18 <dennis> I found the ofx log in quicken, but I don't know if it had the connect url and fid.
22:44:21 <dennis> If I download the OFX file from the bank, it has a different ORG than what the ofx docs say for that bank.
22:44:21 <dennis> but I didn't see any fid or server connect url.
22:47:14 <warlord> How do you "download the OFX file from the bank"?
22:50:40 <dennis> Well it's a web connect download not a direct connect.
22:50:48 <dennis> but just choose download transactions and choose ofx.
22:50:57 <dennis> but direct connect does work for me w/ quicken.
22:51:32 <warlord> Ah, the web connect will have a diff. URL
22:55:16 <dennis> file doesn't show the url anyway.
22:55:52 <dennis> will aqbanking work w/ webconnect files?
22:56:14 <warlord> You dont need AqB for Webconnect files. Just File -> Import -> OFX
22:56:31 <dennis> but I don't want to go download the ofx file manually 1st.
22:57:58 <warlord> Well then you'll need to figure out the OFX-DC settings.
22:58:09 <dennis> exactly :)
22:58:27 <dennis> apparently they are not the same as what is listed on the ofx blog etc.
22:58:40 <dennis> because I'm sure the username/password is correct.
23:00:21 <dennis> quicking is using this: https://onlineofx.chase.com/chase.ofx
23:00:24 <dennis> which I've tried.
23:00:33 <dennis> but I don't know what they are sending for org & fid
23:04:16 <warlord> I believe it should be available within the ofx log.
23:09:20 <dennis> unfortunately, I'm more quickly learning how much of my financial information quicken sends back to Intuit than I am the correct information for connecting.
23:10:24 <warlord> Heheh
23:10:35 * benjamin should have gone to bed long ago
23:12:39 <benjamin> damn this FTP server!
23:13:35 <warlord> Heheh.
23:15:08 <benjamin> it'd be quicker to install an ssh client, create a shell account on the server, log in, look up the shell command to do what I want to do, and type it in
23:16:47 <benjamin> additionally, wordpress's theming system is a tool of the devil
23:20:34 <dennis> This is my problem: http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Finding_OFX_Info_With_Quicken
23:20:51 <dennis> intuit is scraping their site w/ my login data
23:20:59 <dennis> and downloading the web connect file.
23:21:34 <warlord> Oh. OOPS.
23:21:50 <dennis> hence why I can't log in with ofxdirectconnect.
23:22:01 <warlord> That would be why.
23:22:34 <dennis> Can gnucash be automated from the command line?
23:22:44 <dennis> because I could write a script to download my ofx file pretty easily.
23:22:52 <dennis> then could tell gnucash to load the file.
23:24:02 <dennis> maybe I could tell quicken to keep scraping the info for me :)
23:24:05 <warlord> Not in that way.
23:24:25 <dennis> send the ofx request to intuit :)
23:28:17 <dennis> I read some stuff about user keys in ofx.
23:28:28 <dennis> having to send the same key.
23:28:36 <warlord> The UserID or something.
23:28:44 <dennis> I actually did find a couple transactions sent to chases directconnect url.
23:28:45 <warlord> That's "new" and requires "new" AqB ..
23:30:22 <dennis> there a way to get gnucash to dump the request/response for ofx?
23:30:38 <dennis> I see lots of debugging messages, but not the actual data sent/received.
23:31:16 <warlord> Yeah, there's a way.. I dont know how. See the wiki?
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23:47:24 <benjamin> I must find a more efficient way of taking caffeine than dissolving it in an acidic solution of toxins and carcinogens
23:47:58 <warlord> Intraveinously?
23:48:15 <benjamin> not quite that efficient
23:48:30 <benjamin> let's constrain ourselves to oral administration
23:50:58 <benjamin> hmm
23:51:01 <benjamin> some sort of tablet, perhaps
23:51:22 <warlord> No-Doze?
23:51:30 <benjamin> don't want too large a dosage, though. maybe it comes in slow-release form...
23:51:52 <benjamin> assuming you didn't make that up, I will note it
23:52:49 <warlord> I did not make it up.
23:52:52 <warlord> google for it.
23:53:04 <warlord> 200mg of caffeine.
23:54:13 <benjamin> excellent
23:56:25 <benjamin> but while the pound is worth slightly less than the gold content of a pint of seawater, I will refrain from importing things from the US
23:57:05 <benjamin> besides, the fact that the second google result for that search has the title "caffeine dependency" unnerves me a little
23:57:14 <warlord> hahahah