2019-06-25 GnuCash IRC logs
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09:34:52 <gjanssens> .
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10:06:59 <chris> if Owners have had currency for a few releases I'd think it's safe to assume invoices/bills must use the same currency, and locked to the APAR same-currency account?
10:08:42 <gjanssens> chris: why ?
10:09:13 <chris> I see glimpses within business reports whereby they need to confirm currencies for owner = invoice = account
10:10:16 <chris> or, they make assumptions as such
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10:13:12 <chris> e.g. "Receivables Aging" report also requests single-currency Receivables Account, yet has option for Multi-currency Totals
10:13:17 <gjanssens> I don't know all the intricacies in that area
10:14:00 <gjanssens> It certainly looks like it's currently not possible to create invoices in currencies other than the owner's currency.
10:14:09 <chris> exactly...
10:14:49 <chris> even if invoice->entries can link to any Income currency but then crashes
10:14:51 <gjanssens> However IIRC invoices and owners store their currency independently internally
10:15:02 <gjanssens> And I believe there is reason to support this.
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10:15:46 <gjanssens> Imagine the Euro case: before the year 2000 each European country had its own national currency
10:15:46 <chris> in any case I can fix customer-summary.scm's glaring bugs
10:16:16 <gjanssens> So I would have Belgian vendors invoicing me in Belgian Francs and German vendors in German Mark
10:16:36 <gjanssens> After the introduction of the Euro currency all these vendors now use the euro.
10:17:09 <gjanssens> So I have updated the vendors, but the old bills will remain in the respective old currencies.
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10:18:25 <chris> ah makes sense
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10:32:27 <gjanssens> It's not too common, but it does happen that owner currencies change over time (other countries have introduced new currencies over time) so we have to support that
10:34:56 <chris> ok. i'll review customer-summary.scm
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10:37:04 <chris> wrt other PRs - jqplot-removal; book-reports; book-accounting-period - do you think these are good candidates for master? or shall i drop 1-2?
10:45:09 <gjanssens> I think jqplot-removal is ready (I haven't checked again since my review)
10:45:59 <gjanssens> I want to play a bit with the other two before I can make a final judgement
10:46:40 <gjanssens> They're certainly good concepts. I just want to be sure we have properly covered all backward compat scenarios
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10:51:24 <chris> ok i'll leave them alone
10:55:36 <chris> now off to bed :)
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13:31:50 <jralls> fell: Did you see https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=797291? What's the procedure for updating iso-4217-currencies.xml?
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13:39:38 <fell> jralls: Oh, that is new, that they publish CcyMnrUnts
13:40:31 <jralls> Meaning that https://www.currency-iso.org/dam/downloads/lists/list_one.xml did n't have that entry before last August?
13:40:54 <fell> But the problem i: What will happen with old entries in your file.
13:42:11 <jralls> We need to keep them for the same reason that gjanssens explained to chris about old invoices: Just because a currency goes out of use doesn't change the history in a book.
13:42:36 <fell> I have to confess after Geert converted out SCM table into an xml list, I did no longer update it on a regular base.
13:42:50 <fell> A list is too time consuming.
13:44:37 <jralls> So we can't use list_one.xml (what a stupid name) directly. I guess we need an xslt of some sort to update our file from iso's and flag currency changes like last year's Saõ Tomé Dobra change.
13:45:32 <fell> There was this old bug, that you can not increase the number of decimals. That was the stopper to drop decimals fo several currencies.
13:47:36 <jralls> Oh, you mean that if Hieut has an account with SCU set to 2 and we update the VND to 0 that GnuCash will crash on him?
13:49:20 <jralls> There's https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=797280, which isn't old, along those lines. It doesn't crash, GC just ignores the setting and uses the commodity setting in most places.
13:57:43 <fell> I can not find it. It was something like "SCU ignored"
13:58:07 <fell> after increasing
14:03:07 <jralls> Did you check for closed? That would be either "not a bug" or "won't fix".
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14:05:47 <fell> I just created an account phone with 3 decimals, so it seems fixed.
14:07:35 <jralls> Meaning that it didn't crash? It won't actually display or store fractions smaller than the currency's SCU.
14:08:52 <fell> Or not, if I enter 0.005 the result is 0.010
14:12:49 <jralls> So it displays three decimals even though it forces the amount to the SCU. We should fix that. Do you want to write the bug or shall I?
14:14:31 <fell> In the file, I get:
14:14:33 <fell> <split:value>1/100</split:value>
14:14:37 <fell> <split:quantity>10/1000</split:quantity>
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14:16:06 <fell> Go for it.
14:16:29 <fell> It is the blocker for a bunch of currency bugs.
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14:21:45 <fell> Another difference between the currency.xml: ISO has only recent currencies, but we have users with records before EUR introduction (ADF, BEF, DEM, ...) and other replacements i.e. in PL, RU,,,
14:22:14 <fell> So we can not drop old currencies.
14:22:32 <jralls> I said that already.
14:23:08 <jralls> The new bug is https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=797292. Please add to it the currency bugs it blocks.
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14:26:02 <jralls> But wait, if they're just SCU change blocks then *that's* not a problem but fixing it might be: Suppose Hieut has transactions with .xx VND and we change the SCU to 1. Do we go through all of his transactions and round them?
14:30:05 <jralls> We'd need to save the reconciled and ending balances, round them directly, and potentially create a adjustment entry in each account if the sum of the transactions doesn't add up to that.
14:36:54 <jralls> And of course scrub every account as well to change <act:commodity-scu> to the new value.
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14:59:10 <fell> I think, accounts with fractions should keep the decimals. I have i.e. Income (DEM) for old records
15:01:35 <fell> in Gnucash 1.9 was an euroconverter, but it was not ported to 2.0
15:02:04 <jralls> Did DEM change its fraction at some point? But the ultimate case is GBP which went from 1/480 to 1/100 in 1971. (And from 1/960 to 1/480 in 1958.)
15:02:48 <jralls> Dunno if it still works but there's plenty of euroconverter remnants floating around.
15:03:04 <jralls> Anyway, GTG, back in 90 minutes or so.
15:06:47 <fell> 1871 started the union of 1 Taler (=3M) and Mark. Since then Mark was decimal, but ATS had at some point a similar conversion like GBP. Old currencies were often still using the sumerian 12 as base.
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15:18:11 <fell> jralls, with https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781634#c32 you reopened that bug.
15:19:04 <fell> oops #c34
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16:37:02 <jralls> fell: Reopened for want of a scrub function. I suspect that our exposure to that is small enough that it's not really worth it.
16:50:35 <jralls> @tell fell I reopened https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781634 for want of a scrub function, but I wonder if our exposure to the issue is small enough (only two languages and 1 release) that it's not really worth it.
16:50:35 <gncbot> jralls: The operation succeeded.
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17:02:22 <fell> .
17:02:22 <gncbot> fell: Sent 11 minutes ago: <jralls> I reopened https://bugs.gnucash.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781634 for want of a scrub function, but I wonder if our exposure to the issue is small enough (only two languages and 1 release) that it's not really worth it.
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17:22:04 <jralls> fell: Back to currencies, https://www.currency-iso.org/dam/downloads/lists/list_three.xml has the historical ones.
17:22:51 <fell> Oh, good to know.
17:25:11 <fell> But it is missing the "frozen rate to" and "replaced by"
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17:26:06 <fell> e.g. RUR 1000 -> RUB 1
17:27:19 <jralls> Yes, and they're both missing local-symbol, unit name, and partname. We can't replace our table with the combined list, but we can use the two of them to maintain our lists.
17:28:18 <fell> yep
17:28:26 <jralls> Replaced-by can be determined by matching <CtryNm>.
17:29:31 <fell> If it remains.
17:29:57 <jralls> Countries don't often go out of business...
17:30:09 <fell> examples: Former SU, YU
17:30:34 <fell> Split of SS from Sudan
17:31:00 <jralls> That's a formation, Sudan still exists.
17:33:00 <fell> But SS is new and it's currency at the beginning was 1:1
17:33:05 <jralls> But names do change. The SU didn't quite go out of business, it just shrank and changed its name to Russian Federation. One might argue that Yugoslavia did the same, changing its name to Serbia. It's a weaker argument than with CCCP.
17:34:02 <jralls> Anyway, automated maintenance will require human intervention in some cases.
17:39:11 <fell> and they have links: ARMENIA, RUR, 1994-08
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17:42:01 <chris> .
17:44:32 <jralls> That's not quite a link. It's saying that Armenia discontinued using the RUR in August 1994. Note that until December 1990 it would have been the SUR.
17:45:51 <chris> my customer-summary.scm can handle customers with multiple currencies, and totals in multiple currencies...
17:45:52 <chris> https://imgur.com/a/zLRrBEB
17:46:07 <jralls> \o/
17:47:10 <chris> small upgrade from the lol report before...
17:49:47 <fell> Chris, can you flag the Markup change with [I18N]. I fear some translator used the formula instead of the word to find the right term after user complains.
17:50:19 <chris> what markup
17:51:02 <fell> Column 4 in your image
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17:52:04 <chris> I haven't changed the wording at all
17:52:14 <fell> But the formula
17:52:42 <chris> neither
17:53:10 <chris> is still profit/sale-price
17:53:40 <fell> https://lists.gnucash.org/logs/2019/06/24.html#T21:44:35
17:54:18 <fell> Oh
17:58:18 <chris> anyway back to bed, will check for bugs and push when ready
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18:18:29 <fell> <CtryNm>ANTARCTICA</CtryNm><CcyNm>No universal currency</CcyNm> :-)
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20:28:11 <fell> oh, after starting LANG=C gnucash, I get console output: ...
20:28:13 <fell> Found Finance::Quote version 1.47.
20:28:14 <fell> sys:1: Warning: invalid unclassed pointer in cast to 'GtkWidget'
20:28:16 <fell> sys:1: Warning: invalid unclassed pointer in cast to 'GtkLayout'
20:28:17 <fell> f
20:32:57 <fell> from opening "Save changes to "&Accountname
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22:15:57 * fell is wondering, if we should display the "New Invoice" toolbar button only, if customers are defined.
22:17:59 <fell> In contrast to a "new bill" button, the "new invoice" button makes no sense for most users.
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