GNUcash and Owncloud

Fri May 27 19:05:10 EDT 2016

Thanks for the info guys!

I don't believe I'll encounter any issues especially since there are only
two of us and we're in contact every day so it's not any more difficult to
call/text when one of us is using it.

I assumed you guys (David and Mark) knew what transactional file locking is
and just mentioned it because OwnCloud has it in by default. I included the
link for others on the mailing list who aren't aware of OwnCloud and/or
what transactional file locking is (I should have made that more clear).

If GNUCash does alert the second user that the file is in use by default
even in a cloud environment as David mentioned, then I think that will be
more than sufficient as long as I go over the other topics mentioned
regarding changing, saving, et al with my partner.

Any other particularly useful tips anyone has come across? I've used
quickbooks in the past but wanted to move to GNUCash for numerous reasons
(hence I'm a new GNUCash user).

On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 3:16 PM, Mark Phillips <mark at phillipsmarketing.biz>
wrote:

> Sorry about the confusion on posters! I probably need some more
> coffee.....;)
>
> David, now that you mention the locking file, I remember it well. It
> sometimes rears its ugly head when one has Gnucash open and the machine
> reboots. However, a user can still open the file (which deletes/rewrites
> the lock), at least on my Ubuntu machine....see the attached screen shot.
> As it happens, I had Gnucash open yesterday and a subsequent reboot, so I
> got that message.
>
> Mark
>
> On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 11:55 AM, David T. <sunfish62 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> GnuCash *does* use a lockfile to check to see whether the file has been
>> opened on another user’s machine, and I believe that this locking system
>> will alert a second user that the file is in use by another, even in a
>> cloud situation.
>>
>> It’s not clear to me that Cody (not David) misunderstood your comment
>> regarding multiple simultaneous users. @Cody: are you hoping that
>> transactional file locking will allow both users to access the data
>> simultaneously? If so, just don’t go there; it won’t work.
>>
>> David
>>
>> On May 27, 2016, at 2:38 PM, Mark Phillips <mark at phillipsmarketing.biz>
>> wrote:
>>
>> David,
>>
>> I don't think it will work as you hope. From the link you sent -
>>
>> "Multiple users can open and edit a file at the same time and
>> Transactional File locking does not prevent this. Rather, it prevents
>> simultaneous file saving."
>>
>> You still have the issue with Gnucash reading the entire data file at
>> startup and then writing it back when you close Gnucash. One issue is
>> simultaneous file writing, but that event has a small probability of
>> happening given two people acting independently. Note - when one person
>> writes data back to owncloud, your copy of Gnucash does not re-read the
>> data file and merge the changes in your session with the changes from the
>> other user. That is the core of a multi-user system, which is not in
>> Gnucash.
>>
>> The bigger issue is the last one to close Gnucash will over write
>> everything that the other person saved. It is not a multi-user application,
>> and I don't believe it is possible to make it one with external programs.
>> Gnucash itself would have to become a multi-user application to solve this
>> problem.
>>
>> You will need something outside of owncloud to synchronize between two
>> users....like a phone call or sms message to say "I am done, you go ahead".
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 7:54 AM, Cody Hofstetter <
>> codyhofstettermailinglistemail at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Mark and David!
>>>
>>> I'll definitely look into the discussions about serial remote access.
>>> Owncloud does perform transactional file locking by default but I need to
>>> look into it further to make sure everything correctly works with GNUCash.
>>> I'm hoping I can get it setup correctly to avoid any collisions for the
>>> exact reasons mentioned. If any one else is interested in looking at the
>>> features -
>>> https://doc.owncloud.org/server/9.0/admin_manual/configuration_files/files_locking_transactional.html
>>>
>>> Thanks again!
>>>
>>> On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 8:33 PM, David T. <sunfish62 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Cody,
>>>>
>>>> Mark’s warnings about multi-user access should be taken seriously;
>>>> GnuCash is NOT multi-user.
>>>>
>>>> In addition, there have been discussions about serial access to remote
>>>> files that may not yet have been synced to the cloud; rapid recall of such
>>>> files could theoretically result in the same kinds of corruption, although
>>>> the discussions in the past were hypothetical in nature (i.e., no one had
>>>> actually experienced such corruption).
>>>>
>>>> For some of the history, try "gnucash dropbox site:lists.gnucash.org”
>>>> at google. You’ll see some of the discussions there.
>>>>
>>>> HTH,
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>> > On May 26, 2016, at 7:19 PM, Mark Phillips <
>>>> mark at phillipsmarketing.biz> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > Cody,
>>>> >
>>>> > I have not used Owncloud for this application. However, many people
>>>> on the
>>>> > list have used Dropbox or Drive to put Gnucash in the cloud.
>>>> >
>>>> > A critical caveat - Gnucash is not a multiuser application. When
>>>> Gnucash
>>>> > starts it loads the entire database into memory, you make changes,
>>>> and it
>>>> > only writes changes back to a file when the program is closed. If
>>>> both of
>>>> > you open Gnucash and make some edits, then save back to the cloud,
>>>> there is
>>>> > no guarantee what will happen. Best case scenario, the last one to
>>>> save
>>>> > will win, which means if you are the last one to save to Owncloud,
>>>> then all
>>>> > you partner's edits will be lost. Worst case scenario, the file will
>>>> become
>>>> > corrupted and you will both loose all your edits.
>>>> >
>>>> > Caveat Emptor.....
>>>> >
>>>> > Mark
>>>> >
>>>> > On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Cody Hofstetter <
>>>> > codyhofstettermailinglistemail at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Hello everyone,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I've just set up an Owncloud instance with collaborative document
>>>> editing
>>>> >> and am looking to share a set of books between my business partner
>>>> and I.
>>>> >> It's a small business and only the two of us have access to the
>>>> server.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I'm wondering if anyone has any experience using Owncloud/GNUCash
>>>> together
>>>> >> and has recommendations for ease of use, best practices they've
>>>> found, and
>>>> >> any other relevant info?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thanks!
>>>> >> --
>>>> >>
>>>> >> *Thanks,*
>>>> >> *Cody Hofstetter*
>>>> >> *CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com
>>>> >> <CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com>*
>>>> >> CodyHofstetter.com <http://codyhofstetter.com>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Feel free to contact me at this email anytime
>>>
>>> *Thanks,*
>>> *Cody Hofstetter*
>>> *CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com
>>> <CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com>*
>>> CodyHofstetter.com <http://codyhofstetter.com/>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>

-- 
Feel free to contact me at this email anytime

*Thanks,*
*Cody Hofstetter*
*CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com
<CodyHofstetterMailingListEmail at gmail.com>*
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