Bank/CC to Expense, diff currencies

Ken Runge kr at bell.net
Thu Mar 30 12:21:14 EDT 2017 

Thanks for your reply and going to the trouble of posting screen shots 
which I have looked at. Unfortunately they do not change my opinion on 
how to proceed.

Screen 1
If the USD exp. was $100 your USD CC bank account would reconcile but 
the CND expense cost would be understated by <>$35
Screen 2
The CND amt would be correct but your USD CC bank account would not 
reconcile as the bank's records would have a USD $100 charge and GC 
would show USD $135.
Screen's 3 & 4 (the same I think)
Both the USD and CND amounts would be correct using their respective 
trading accounts (thanks Google translate). This is what I would like to 
do but...
     -I find the input process confusing & difficult to get correct on 
the first try. Once the input goes wrong there is created a plethora of 
out-of-balance entries which are hard if not impossible to get rid of.
     -Even if it works it is time consuming and I have other things to 
occupy my life.

Conclusion:
The parallel set of USD accounts was a pain to set up but processing USD 
(foreign to me) transactions is fairly straight forward. I had to do 
some experimenting with the I/E statement and it works OK. Only drawback 
is that the exchange rate is not set for each transaction and the 
reported USD amount changes with market fluctuations but I can live with 
that.

Thanks
Ken


On 3/29/17 9:29 A, 9:29, Christoph R wrote:
> Apparently one cannot send attachments to the list.
>
> Here is a link to the screenshots: 
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/q2wex56hud9p1nh/AACGcS9-euJaTR0n6dOvifvBa?dl=0
>
> Cheers,
> Christoph
>
>> Am 29.03.2017 um 14:29 schrieb Christoph R 
>> <subscriptions+listen at rohland.net 
>> <mailto:subscriptions+listen at rohland.net>>:
>>
>> Oops, apparently the pictures are missing. Trying again
>>
>>
>>
>> Gruß,
>> Christoph
>>
>>> Am 29.03.2017 um 14:25 schrieb Christoph R 
>>> <subscriptions+listen at rohland.net 
>>> <mailto:subscriptions+listen at rohland.net>>:
>>>
>>> Hi Ken,
>>>
>>>
>>>> In the end; however, this is all a moot point as I have concluded 
>>>> that except for the transfer of monies between balance sheet 
>>>> accounts, that is bank a/c to bank a/c or bank a/c to CC account, 
>>>> GC is unable to handle two currencies in the same transaction, such 
>>>> as the example noted above.
>>>
>>> I am using multi-currency transactions with any kind of account. But 
>>> I know that the interface might be confusing. It especially depends 
>>> if you use trading accounts or not.
>>>
>>> If you are using the default setting without trading accounts you 
>>> have to fill out all splits in the local currency. This means in the 
>>> USD CC account the transaction looks like this:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> and in the Canadian espense account it looks like this:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If you enable trading accounts gc does behave nearly as you expect: 
>>> Every split has to be entered in the split currency and the 
>>> transaction is shown the same way in both accounts:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> But in both cases gc will bring up the exchange rate window and you 
>>> have to enter that in addition.
>>>
>>> HTH
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Christoph
>>>
>>>> Am 27.03.2017 um 00:38 schrieb Ken Runge <kr at bell.net 
>>>> <mailto:kr at bell.net>>:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your reply, I must admit after reading my previous late 
>>>> night rant born out of frustration I am pleasantly surprised you 
>>>> bothered. Also sorry for not replying earlier but ran into another 
>>>> problem which would have nixed my using GC at all, but that has now 
>>>> been resolved. So my reply to your reply much of it written last 
>>>> week...
>>>>
>>>> _It sounds like you're not quite understanding the basics of 
>>>> double-entry accounting. _Please excuse my trumpishness, but, after 
>>>> 25 years experience as the chief accountant in a multi-million 
>>>> dollar social service agency with 500+ employees using and 
>>>> supervising an accounting staff working with Microsoft Dynamics, 
>>>> which I initially evaluated, purchased, installed and trained 
>>>> others to use, not to mention instructing accounting at the local 
>>>> community college, I am pretty sure I have the hang of that 
>>>> 'double-entry' thingy you mentioned.
>>>>
>>>> My problem is not understanding the concepts of accounting but how 
>>>> to implement those concepts with GU! This is, at its base, a 
>>>> technical issue wherein I would like to understand the work flow 
>>>> (order of key strokes if you will) of how to actually enter a 
>>>> multi-currency transaction. What I am after is an efficient method 
>>>> to get the following input starting with an entry from a Bank 
>>>> downloaded QFX file.
>>>>
>>>> DB CND Expense $132.000
>>>> CR USD Credit Card Account $100.00
>>>>
>>>> In my dreams I would like to enter these two lines into, say the 
>>>> USD CC register, which is designated USD while the Exp. account is 
>>>> designated CDN and let the program fill in the blanks using the 
>>>> Trading Accounts for USD & CND. What I find is happening is a 
>>>> proliferation of unwanted 'out-of-balance' splits which I can't 
>>>> seem to get rid off and which I think should not even appear except 
>>>> perhaps if the entry, when finished, is not balanced. Of course, if 
>>>> the Trading Account function worked as it should the transaction, 
>>>> in its entirety, would never be out of balance. I think, or I 
>>>> thought at one time, I can get the transaction to balance but the 
>>>> process is difficult and cumbersome and frankly a pain-in-the-ass.
>>>>
>>>> _When I travel to a foreign country I just manually convert the 
>>>> foreign transactions back into USD and use my USD Asset/Liability 
>>>> and Expense accounts. _But, of course, your example is not 
>>>> multi-currency but rather a 'back-of-an-envelope' example. If you 
>>>> had a actual EUR, GBP or CND account so designated in GC then your 
>>>> calculations would not work because you need to start with the 
>>>> non-USD amount as my example above outlines. If you charge the 
>>>> converted USD amount to the foreign currency account you would 
>>>> never be able to download and reconcile that account because your 
>>>> bank statement would report GBP 10.00 but your GC account would 
>>>> show something different. What I think you maybe referring to is 
>>>> what happens when your USA bank does the conversion for you and 
>>>> charges your USD account with the equivalent of the foreign 
>>>> purchase. From GC's point of view this is not multi-currency.
>>>>
>>>> In the end; however, this is all a moot point as I have concluded 
>>>> that except for the transfer of monies between balance sheet 
>>>> accounts, that is bank a/c to bank a/c or bank a/c to CC account, 
>>>> GC is unable to handle two currencies in the same transaction, such 
>>>> as the example noted above. Accordingly, I have created a parallel 
>>>> set of expense accounts in USD and will record USD CC to USD exp. 
>>>> Still a major pain for a program which purports to support 
>>>> multi-currency but one has to work with what has available. Sure 
>>>> hope I don't open GBP or EUR bank accounts in the future!  With 
>>>> some experimenting I have got an I/E report to show what I am 
>>>> looking for.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again for your interest.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/22/17 1:08 P, 13:8, Derek Atkins wrote:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken Runge<kr at bell.net <mailto:kr at bell.net>>  writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks for your input. Let me start by relating an experience 
>>>>>> from a training
>>>>>> session I attended many years ago. At that event one of our group 
>>>>>> (me) was
>>>>>> given a simple diagram and asked to describe it to the others of 
>>>>>> the group
>>>>>> such that, unseen by them, they could draw it. It was a hopeless 
>>>>>> and utter
>>>>>> failure! This is what is happening to me now. I simply have no 
>>>>>> idea what you
>>>>>> are saying.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Transfer" referes to the "Transfer Account".  In a basic 
>>>>>> register it's
>>>>>> the "other" account (to balance the transaction).  If you're in an
>>>>>> expanded transaction mode it referes to the account tied to the 
>>>>>> specific
>>>>>> split on that line."
>>>>> It sounds like you're not quite understanding the basics of 
>>>>> double-entry
>>>>> accounting.  Every balanced transaction must have at least two 
>>>>> splits, a
>>>>> Debit and a Credit, which balance out.  It models moving money 
>>>>> from one
>>>>> place to another, e.g. you buy $100 of groceries with your credit 
>>>>> card,
>>>>> so you Credit your Liabilities:Credit Card account $100 and then Debit
>>>>> Expenses:Groceries that same $100.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you open an account register, you're tying all transactions 
>>>>> back to
>>>>> that account.  It also hides the second split, since it can be mostly
>>>>> inferred from the primary.  So when you enter a transaction you're
>>>>> e.g. debiting the "register account" and then crediting the "Transfer
>>>>> Account", which is the *other* account in the second split of the
>>>>> transaction.
>>>>>
>>>>>> If I use the basic register and select the expense account and 
>>>>>> enter CND
>>>>>> amount as a debit on the single line of the register, the expense 
>>>>>> and USD cc
>>>>>> amounts are reversed.
>>>>> NOTE: It's possible this behavior has changed recently.  Historically
>>>>> the register shows you values in the current account currency. 
>>>>>  I.e., if
>>>>> you have a USD account open, then it will show you all values in USD.
>>>>> Then you need to use the exchange-rate dialog to convert that to any
>>>>> foreign currency amounts.  It's POSSIBLE that this changed, 
>>>>> however.  In
>>>>> basic mode it definitely shows values in the local account currency.
>>>>>
>>>>> What account register are you opening here?  Are you opening your 
>>>>> USD CC
>>>>> account?  Or the CND Expense Account?  (Do I have that right -- you
>>>>> haven't been completely explicit about what you're opening/doing). 
>>>>>  The
>>>>> register would give you values in that currency and expect you to 
>>>>> enter
>>>>> them in that currency.
>>>>>
>>>>> If the amounts are reversed then you're possibly entering them in the
>>>>> wrong columns.  Are you doing that?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there any reason not to just convert the expense into your local
>>>>>> currency?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And just how do I do that?
>>>>> Simple math.
>>>>>
>>>>> When I travel to a foreign country I just manually convert the foreign
>>>>> transactions back into USD and use my USD Asset/Liability and Expense
>>>>> accounts.  So let's say I pay €100 for a hotel room.  I'd figure out
>>>>> exactly how much that is in USD (e.g. $125.34) and then I'd enter a
>>>>> transaction for that USD amount.  I'd notate the transaction to remind
>>>>> me it was €100, but all *numbers* are all in USD.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks anyway
>>>>>>
>>>>
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